Which Side? 74/75 or 95/96?

With an afternoon of mot much to do and gazing back in time at 2 of our all time best Test Sides, I looked at the comparison between the stats of Ian Chappell's 74/75 vs Mark Taylor's 95/96 side.

Of course it is not a true comparison of the sides themselves, rather a look at the players of those sides and their overall careers.

But it makes for some interesting comparisons.

74/75 Side
--Player---------Mat--Runs--Ave---Wkts--Ave--WK
1 R McCosker---25---1622--39.56
2 I Redpath-----66---4737--43.45
3 I Chappell----75----5345--42.42--20--65.80
4 G Chappell---87----7110--53.86--47--40.70
5 KD Walters---74----5357--48.26--49--29.08
6 R Edwards----20----1171--40.33
7 R Marsh-------86---3633--26.51--------------355
8 D Lillee--------70----905 -13.71--355--23.92
9 M Walker------34----586--19.53--138--27.47
10 A Mallett-----38----430--11.63--132--29.84
11 J Thomson---51----679--12.81--200--28.00

95/96 Side
--Player--------Mat---Runs--Ave-----Wkts--Ave--WK
1 M Taylor------104---7525--43.49
2 M Slater-------74---5312--42.83
3 D Boon-------107---7422--43.65
4 M Waugh-----128---8029--41.81--59--41.16
5 S Waugh-----168--10927--51.85--92--37.44
6 R Ponting-----168--13378--51.85
7 I Healy-------119---4356--27.39----------------395
8 S Warne------145---3154--17.32-708--25.41
9 P Riefel--------35-----955--26.52-104--26.96
10 C McDermott-71----940--12.20--291--28.63
11 G McGrath--124     641   7.36  563   21.64

------------------------------74/75-----95/96
All batters Runs  per test---50.44-----50.39
Top 7 Batters Runs per test-66.92----65.61
Top 7 batters Average-------42.06----43.15
Aggregate batting average--352.07---365.48
Side batting Average----------32.01---33.23
top 6 bowlers Average--------29.84---30.21
top 6 bowlers: Wkts/test------2.66----2.71

Clearly many more tests per year were played 20 years after Chappelli's side.
More opposition to play, better fitness and conditioning probably.

But the numbers are pretty close.

It would have been a cracking fantasy match!

Very interesting and amazingly close stats.

I'd favour the 70s side slightly, but
but with no tangible reason.

Good debate.

Me too.
For no tangible reason, I like the 74/75 bowling attack more.
Averages of the main strike bowlers might disagree with this, but after McGrath and Warne, the attack is thinner.

Lillee and Thomo are almost the most lethal combination ever (excepting the Windies attack of the 80s) and the 74/75 support bowlers are a bit better I think. Although it is a line ball in some cases. I reckon Max Walker was an underrated bowler as a third stringer. Probably Reiffel's stats would say the same.

I think the 95/96 batting attack probably beats 74/75, but in saying that, it took their whole careers to get to this and not a snap shot taken in 95/96. Eg Punter was a young buck still to cement himself in that era. Blokes like S Waugh, M Waugh, Ponting got better as they got older.

Here is an interesting combo to fuel the debate;

1 Taylor
2 Slater or Redpath (hard to separate)
3 I Chappell
4 G Chappell
5 D Walters (mainly because in 95/96 S Waugh was not as good as later in his career)
6 R Ponting
7 R Marsh
8 S Warne
9 D Lillee
10 J Thomson
11 G McGrath

How do you think this side would go?

Only 4 bowlers, not counting Walters.

Then again, no need for another bowler with that attack.

2 great teams in a very interesting topic
If they played head to head it gets down to perhaps  the winner of the toss and perhaps what venue

Interesting that Chambo would say that Lillie and Thommo was the most lethal
Lethal no doubt
The 'tandem' combination of McGrath and Warne might be better as an overall combination as it lasted a longer time
FOT and Thommo was a few years
Warney and Ooh Ahh went on for a longer time

The one thing that would have been interesting, is if Warne played against the greatest West Indies sides , I think he would have done very well against the top West Indian batsmen

RE Lee's comment, I think Doug Walters was a bit underrated as a bowler. I recall Ian Chappell always rated him as a partnership breaker and that he had some success with that.

Agree, if you had Lillee, Thomo, McGratrh and Warne, Dougy may never have got to bowl!

I can't believe 2 of that combined side departed us this week.

Yes McGrath and Warned bowled together for longer.
It stood our in looking at these sides the aggregate of games played was the glaring number where the differences lay.

During the 80s Windies hey-day, spin did not seem to be the "in-thing". So there familiarity with a barrage of pace might just have been their undoing if Warne was around.

Out spinners of the 80s, didn't seem in the same league of Warne, Lyon and even Macgill and one or two others from the 90s onward.

Chambo Off To Work We Go wrote:Me too.
For no tangible reason, I like the 74/75 bowling attack more.
Averages of the main strike bowlers might disagree with this, but after McGrath and Warne, the attack is thinner.

Lillee and Thomo are almost the most lethal combination ever (excepting the Windies attack of the 80s) and the 74/75 support bowlers are a bit better I think. Although it is a line ball in some cases. I reckon Max Walker was an underrated bowler as a third stringer. Probably Reiffel's stats would say the same.

I think the 95/96 batting attack probably beats 74/75, but in saying that, it took their whole careers to get to this and not a snap shot taken in 95/96. Eg Punter was a young buck still to cement himself in that era. Blokes like S Waugh, M Waugh, Ponting got better as they got older.

Here is an interesting combo to fuel the debate;

1 Taylor
2 Slater or Redpath (hard to separate)
3 I Chappell
4 G Chappell
5 D Walters (mainly because in 95/96 S Waugh was not as good as later in his career)
6  R Ponting
7 R Marsh
8 S Warne
9 D Lillee
10 J Thomson
11 G McGrath

How do you think this side would go?

I just came across this topic.
A very interesting comparison and I too would go for 1974/1975
There is only one position that I would disagree with.
I believe that Healy was certainly a better all round keeper than Marsh. Healy was certainly much better up at the stumps, Marsh would have missed as many stumpings in test cricket as he took and I think Healy was safer standing back with better footwork. Marsh was probably more spectacular. I thought that their batting was on a par.
Things like Teams of the century are certainly subjective, but Healy made the official Australian Cricket team of the 20th century.

I can understand that view.

I wonder if Marsh would have been better up to the stumps if he had someone in Warne's calibre to practice on? Without disparaging Mallett and Jenner, they were not in the same league as Warne. The 70s seemed to be a period devoid of star leggies.

Following another thought, who would be captain?
Do you go for Chappelli or Taylor?
Or even Greg Chappell or Ponting?
At this point in their careers the latter 2 had not captained as yet.

I think Taylor and Chappelli were quite similar captains with similar records from memory.

Chambo Off To Work We Go wrote:

I wonder if Marsh would have been better up to the stumps if he had someone in Warne's calibre to practice on? Without disparaging Mallett and Jenner, they were not in the same league as Warne. The 70s seemed to be a period devoid of star leggies.

Following another thought, who would be captain?
Do you go for Chappelli or Taylor?
Or even Greg Chappell or Ponting?
At this point in their careers the latter 2 had not captained as yet.

I think Taylor and Chappelli were quite similar captains with similar records from memory.

On the contrary, I think a spinner of Warne's talent would have found out Marsh's lack of technique up at the stumps even more so. You mention Mallett. Interestingly he stated that Barry Jarman was the best keeper that he ever had keep to him. And remember Jarman was certainly past his prime when he kept to Mallett.
I have said before the 4 best keepers I have seen in order are Knott, his understudy, Taylor, Grout and his understudy Jarman. I would rate Healy and Jack Russell next as keepers but Healy was a better batsman that all of the above bar perhaps Knott.
All of this is subjective, but I think that Ian Chappell was a much better captain than any of the others you mentioned. Likewise I would have Greg Chappell easily last of the 4 as captain.

Agree about the 'keepers and saw Godfrey Evans also.

I think Healy was excellent.

Knott and Russell were just beautifully skilled with great footwork.  Catches that modern keepers take with a huge dive were caught by them simply, due to footwork.

I also think Darren Berry was a pure keeoer.

Finally  keepers now miss a far greater proportion of stumpings than they did years ago.