HANDS OFF OUR SANFL!!

From "InDaily",

Crows want reserves next year: Chapman
Friday, 31 August 2012

Kevin Naughton

ADELAIDE Football Club chairman Rob Chapman has confirmed the club is actively working towards fielding a reserves team next year.

In the longer term, Chapman would also like to see reserves football making a comeback at a revamped Adelaide Oval in 2014.

Confirming the moves for South Australian and Western Australian AFL clubs to have a reserves side rather than spread their players throughout the SANFL or WAFL, Crows chairman Rob Chapman said the concept would excite footy fans.

“We’ve thought long and hard about it,” he told Indaily yesterday.

“We’ve spoken with Leigh (Whicker) and John Olsen in the SANFL – it’s not on their agenda to have a side in the SANFL next year. I respect that and I understand their reasons why, but we need to look at some alternatives.

“It’s important enough an issue for us to spend time working on it for next year.”

Chapman said while a side in the SANFL for next year had been ruled out, the Crows were looking at alternatives, including temporary options for season 2013.

“Our immediate priority is just to think about what we can do for next year, and then perhaps have some longer-term discussions with the SANFL,” he said.

Reports of a push for a reserves side at West Coast, Fremantle, Port Adelaide and Adelaide surfaced earlier this week after AFL officials visited Perth.

The AFL clubs had expressed frustration after years of players being mismanaged when they lined up across various SANFL and WAFL clubs.

The four AFL clubs demanded assistance from the AFL in taking on the two state football commissions.

Fremantle chief executive Steve Rosich went so far as to propose the Dockers’ second-tier side playing in an amateur competition next season, while Adelaide CEO Steven Trigg said the Crows had considered joining the VFL.

Chapman agreed: “All Victorian clubs have a reserves side and that gives them an edge. As chairman of the Adelaide side I’ve got a responsibility to make sure our guys have an equal or better edge.”

http://www.indaily.com.au/?iid=67390&sr=0#folio=1

Adelaide, Port and West Coast have all won premierships under the current system.

"Mismanaged". Nonsense. The AFL players only train with their SANFL clubs on the light last training session before a game.

In an event, Port could barely field half a Reserves team right now, so how would playing in an amateur comp help them?

Totally ill-conceived idea.

Huge worry for our local SANFL competition.

Like R&B said, all teams won a premiership with the current system...why change it??

They are just putting their failures on the SANFL and blaming them.

The AFL reserves would be a far weaker competition with players holding themselves back in greater numbers.

The sooner the better IMO, Ask yourself why they wont take up the offer of playing their Reserves sides in the SANFL Reserves, its because they want control and ownership of the SANFL. By all means let them finance their own AFL Reserves side. Two games on Adelaide Oval = Two Hire Fees, along with the rental for the AFC training headquarters and so on in addition to the licence fee. The SANFL will come out of it pretty well. Port dont have the capacity to do it, the Crows might, will be interesting to see what happens when they have to back up their talk with action!

I think it's a great idea! The 2 WA teams and the 2 SA teams could play their own round robin series, somewhere central between Perth and Adelaide. Eucla springs immediately to mind. Just off the Eyre Highway, with a petrol station and a motel. I'm sure they could get the locals to scrape out a pretty good playing field in the sandhills, with a 'dozer. If road travel is a problem, the Indian-Pacific could stop at Loongana. There's also an airstrip at Forrest. A couple of hundred kms either way by 4-wheel drive, but hey, the boys could get in a bit of spotlight shooting after the game. Then we can get on with our own competition without these ongoing distractions.

All I want to know is, where would they get their players from? Certainly not from the SANFL. An ordinary season with injuries, etc, they'd only have about 12 players left to select, so who fills the other spots?

Once again, more pie in the sky thinking from AFL level, why doesn't this surprise me?

Ben W wrote:From "InDaily",

Crows want reserves next year: Chapman
Friday, 31 August 2012

Kevin Naughton

The AFL clubs had expressed frustration after years of players being mismanaged when they lined up across various SANFL and WAFL clubs.

The four AFL clubs demanded assistance from the AFL in taking on the two state football commissions.

Fremantle chief executive Steve Rosich went so far as to propose the Dockers’ second-tier side playing in an amateur competition next season, while Adelaide CEO Steven Trigg said the Crows had considered joining the VFL.

Chapman agreed: “All Victorian clubs have a reserves side and that gives them an edge. As chairman of the Adelaide side I’ve got a responsibility to make sure our guys have an equal or better edge.”

http://www.indaily.com.au/?iid=67390&sr=0#folio=1

Years of mismanagement - what a load of rubbish and Kevin Naughton should personally apologise to every SANFL club for writing such garbage. Tell that to players like Ryan Williams who stayed on at Centrals after being delisted by the Power. Tell that to someone like Brent Guerra who won 3 premierships in his short time at Centrals before Port traded him. Perhaps Naughton should have done some research rather than be a wannabe Michaelangelo Rucci with his blatant lies in the article.

Also, Rob Chapman exposes himself as a fool by mistakingly claiming that all Victorian clubs have reserves sides. Last time I checked only 2 AFL sides (Geelong and Collingwood) have fully fledged reserves sides (with Essendon doing likewise next season). If most football supporters understand how the VFL system works, surely an AFL Club President should know this too.

The one good thing to come out of this announcement is that any Crows/Power reserves side will not be in the SANFL. If that happened, the Crows would have lost me as a member and supporter.

I just wonder ..... by "mismanaged", could they by chance be refering to how they leave SANFL clubs waiting to the last minutes to finalise their teams while AFL clubs play duck and drakes with selection, or perhaps they mean screwing up clubs by playing them in SANFL teams during the year but deciding to withdraw their services for finals?

The only mismanagement of AFL players I've seen at Norwood was when Neil Craig was coaching us. Then when he became Crows Coach, he complained about a lack of co-operation from SANFL clubs. Ironic.

Brucetiki wrote:
Years of mismanagement - what a load of rubbish and Kevin Naughton should personally apologise to every SANFL club for writing such garbage.

Maybe congratulations are in order for contributing to the Australian recycling effort.

From the Naughton article:-

"The AFL clubs had expressed frustration after years of players being mismanaged when they lined up across various SANFL and WAFL clubs.

The four AFL clubs demanded assistance from the AFL in taking on the two state football commissions.

Fremantle chief executive Steve Rosich went so far as to propose the Dockers’ second-tier side playing in an amateur competition next season, while Adelaide CEO Steven Trigg said the Crows had considered joining the VFL."



from the recent Wilson article in "The Age" at http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/sa-wa-clubs-to-go-it-alone-20120828-24ysq.html

"Frustrated after years of players being mismanaged as they are forced to field footballers across various SANFL and WAFL clubs, the four AFL teams have demanded assistance from the AFL in taking on the two state football commissions.

Fremantle chief executive Steve Rosich did not rule out withdrawing the Dockers' second-tier players and placing a stand-alone Fremantle team in an amateur competition next season, while Adelaide boss Steven Trigg said the Crows had considered joining the VFL."



Top effort.

Brucetiki wrote:Also, Rob Chapman exposes himself as a fool by mistakingly claiming that all Victorian clubs have reserves sides. Last time I checked only 2 AFL sides (Geelong and Collingwood) have fully fledged reserves sides (with Essendon doing likewise next season).

In the VFL, that's correct, though you could safely throw in Carlton now that have one by stealth in the "Northern Blues" (Preston Bullants - RIP).

Pretty sure the removal of the "12/10" rule with the VFL's AFL club alignments puts more of a "you say jump, we say how high" spin on those arrangements. The re-badgeing of the VFL's reserves into the AFL "Development League" leaves little to the imagination.

Collingwood's "reserves" have only been around a few years and recent success for their AFL side has been good for the propaganda. By contrast, Geelong are doing well now, but were averaging around 9th up to the year they tore "The Power" a new one - Geelong have maintained a VFL side since the Vics ditched their AFL Reserves at the end of '99.

Brisbane have a reserves side in the NEAFL (Grand Final for them this weekend) as do Sydney. Draw your own conclusions as to any effect they've had on "success" at the top level.

StrayDog wrote:Brisbane have a reserves side in the NEAFL (Grand Final for them this weekend) as do Sydney. Draw your own conclusions as to any effect they've had on "success" at the top level.

Will be interesting to see what happens when the AFC take a tumble down the ladder whilst running their own reserves teams and watching their crowds flock to the SANFL as they generally do when the Cows are not playing well! Wonder if it still will be a great idea as they will not be able to negotiate less income to the SANFL and will have to wear 100% of the costs of the Reserves team themselves.

I would be OK if these proposed reserve teams were only allowed in the SANFL reserves, but I'm not sure how it would work properly.

Maybe the Crows could have their own team and the Power leftovers could play for the Magpies?

But as many have mentioned, if there were a significant amount of injuries, how would they fill up a team? The above scenario would work for Port, but where would the Crows pick up players from?

StrayDog wrote:

Brucetiki wrote:
Years of mismanagement - what a load of rubbish and Kevin Naughton should personally apologise to every SANFL club for writing such garbage.

Maybe congratulations are in order for contributing to the Australian recycling effort.

From the Naughton article:-

"The AFL clubs had expressed frustration after years of players being mismanaged when they lined up across various SANFL and WAFL clubs.

The four AFL clubs demanded assistance from the AFL in taking on the two state football commissions.

Fremantle chief executive Steve Rosich went so far as to propose the Dockers’ second-tier side playing in an amateur competition next season, while Adelaide CEO Steven Trigg said the Crows had considered joining the VFL."



from the recent Wilson article in "The Age" at http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/sa-wa-clubs-to-go-it-alone-20120828-24ysq.html

"Frustrated after years of players being mismanaged as they are forced to field footballers across various SANFL and WAFL clubs, the four AFL teams have demanded assistance from the AFL in taking on the two state football commissions.

Fremantle chief executive Steve Rosich did not rule out withdrawing the Dockers' second-tier players and placing a stand-alone Fremantle team in an amateur competition next season, while Adelaide boss Steven Trigg said the Crows had considered joining the VFL."



Top effort.

Good pick up on the 'recycling' StrayDog - for our Media Watch fans out there, looks like Naughton will be getting a worthy nomination for the 'Campbell Reid Perpetual Trophy for the Brazen Recycling of Other People's Work'.

howthewestwaswon wrote:I would be OK if these proposed reserve teams were only allowed in the SANFL reserves, but I'm not sure how it would work properly.

Maybe the Crows could have their own team and the Power leftovers could play for the Magpies?

But as many have mentioned, if there were a significant amount of injuries, how would they fill up a team? The above scenario would work for Port, but where would the Crows pick up players from?

Nope I'm afraid that isn't good enought for me.
I don't care if they want a reserves team. Fine, let them have one.
Just nowhere near that sanfl - league or reserves!

We are a bona fide competition that frankly does not need to survive on the back of afl hopefuls.
The blues have got about 7 afl players (3 of them homegrown) and I would happily let every one of them go, to safeguard the integrity of our competition.

The real push will be when the magpies are probably sacrificed to the Power licence handover. That writing is on the wall in big letters.

This is the unpalatable thing to the afl.
That the sanfl and wafl exist to their own agenda (hopefully!) and not puppets to their string pulling.

The day that an afl reserves team plays in any sanfl comp is the day I walk away from it.
What the sanfl has traditioned for over 125+ years, will have then ceased to exist.

I see you're a Media Watch fan, BT

Agree, Chambo.

I posed the question earlier about where these "Reserves" teams would get players to make up the numbers. One school of thought is they take players from the SANFL U18s competition.

Like hell they will. These players will be SANFL registered players and we would (should) have the right to prevent it, just as they (AFL clubs) have the right to prevent their players playing SANFL finals.

And what happens if one of these U18s players gets injured? How is he covered? No doubt they would feel it is the SANFL club's problem.

It's time the AFL, and its clubs, started to show some interest in the welfare and future of our game rather than short term "fix-it-quick" solutions to what they perceive as problems.

The only REAL problem facing football is over-zealous administration, and I really wish they would curb their excesses.

Yes, you do get the impression that whatever the afl provide by way of "development" handout, or other coin supposedly to grass roots footy (and I can't really see the evidence of that despite their protestations otherwise), it is all geared toward a strong "AFL" rather than a strong "Aussie Rules".

Anything they can't control, is to be indulged as far as it benefits (or doesn't challenge) the AFL.

You can just seen the old administrators of the VFA and VFL (if they are still alive) bristle at what the VFL has become.

The integrity of their competitions and history of their separateness has been enslaved to the AFL greater good. I do admit that they did come together before this mantra took hold, but there is no semblance of their previous footy individuality remaining.

There in itself is a good example (if we need one) why the sanfl must resist this push by the Crows, Port, Freo and Eagles.

I respect the right of the Crows and Power to have their surplus players together in one team
1) if they think that is best for their development and
2) if they can find a competition for them to play in.

However they do not have the right to destroy the integrity of the 135 year old SANFL league competition by introducting sides to that competition that do not exist to win premierships.

It would be like adding rasberry cordial to a glass of Grange.

IF the Crows & Power go it alone the logical first step for me is to play in the SANFL Reserves.

It may well be the only way the Magpies can be saved as PAFC could simply not afford a Power league & resevres plus seperate Magpies league reserves, Under 18's,

By combining Magpies reserves and Power reserves in the same side, the Magpies would still have their league side existing to win premierships but would need a smaller seniorlist to do so which should reduce their SANFL salary expenses plus they could receive some greater transfer income if more junior players from their zone need to go to other clubs.

Why not try this first rather than incur the expense of playing in the VFL or
a new comp involving interstate travel?

West Coast has 3 flags & 1 runners up, Adelaide with 2 flags & Port 1 flag & 1 runners up, so that's 6 flags & 2 runners ups in 20 years...yeah this system doesn't work & i'm just as sure Western Bulldogs, ST Kilda etc would hate to have that record

personally while some of the AFL lads who have played for Glenelg & the other teams for that matter have entertained me, yet some others look disinterested & i'd be happy if they all played elsewhere, anywhere but in our much cherished competition, lets face facts if the VFL & its clubs weren't going brokeback then we would have the same football landscape as we had up to the late 1980's

I have just asked Kris Grant & I HAVE obtained The Club's approval, if I can put a sign up on the eastern mound at Elizabeth Oval for the entire season, it will say something along the lines of HANDS OFF OUR SANFL or AFL RESERVES FOR AFL ONLY!
Does anyone have any other ideas?
This IS endorsed by The CDFC.
I am currently getting a quote on how much it will cost to create, I can't afford this on my own, will anyone else help cover the cost?

Can you create the sign in the shape of a big middle finger?

For maximum effect, the same sign in the same location at every ground would send a message.

That's a lot more dollars of course.

Would the clubs support an endeavour like that?

I recall a couple of seasons ago, some stickers that went around to the clubs saying the same message. Not sure who organised that one.

I think the decision is made by the Clubs?

Supporters should make sure their own clubs are aware of our feelings.

If you can make me some of these, then I'll be on board.

Interesting that the CDFC is happy to approve such a thing. Good on them for supporting the cause though.

I think the other clubs will be a little more measured in their responses/thoughts/actions.

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/hands-off-our-sanfl/